Test

[gl45]

Bill,
Few weeks ago I did ask you do be delete from your web site, with no avail. The funny thing about, you didn't ask me why of my decision.
One day long time ago, at Pim with Jeff, Ritchie, Brooks, Gary and I can't remember who else was there, I selected a horse in a DEL race that paid $40.00. I didn't bet the horse, but nobody did ask me what did I use to select that horse. Do you remember one post that I use the Matchup to select a winner that paid $40 and you did bet it? You didn't ask me how I came to that selection, but if you read the post is very obvious. Who selected the winners at LRL for the Pace & Cap race? You and me. Did I ask you what did you used to select that horse? NO, and you didn't ask me how as well.
Does Hirshman ask? No. Does Gary ask? No. Does Ritchie ask? No. I don't.
Bill, I'm attaching a readouts. Can you select the winner? Is in feet per second. You have as much knoweledge about this as every Sartinistas.
Try and Work as you describe in your follow up post.

[admin]

Hello Pino

I moved your post over to here because lets keep
The contest threads as is
This way people can review the races only

Now I will adress your question

I did not delete you from the site That was and is your decision
If you don't want to be part of the group thats your choice ,Then don,t
read it If your getting email notifications about post
then I can fix that and you wont need to read what you don't want I
did ask you to step away and maybe if you wanted to I suggested that you read the Yellow manual, All the follow ups and the The Psychology of Winning manual.
. Next I remember the Delaware race. Nobody asked you for details
because to be fair, That gathering as well as Pace and Cap day
was more of a social gathering,Then a workshop, There really was not that much time to do that in that setting and I had only had a very short time to meet and talk to you as well as all the new folks
The Race at Pace and cap day, I thought you used the match up
as at the time The hat check area was very active and
I had just returned 1 week earlier from my visit to Oklahoma
I won the race but as I always have I used basic Sartin methodology
steps ,as well as what I picked up from Doc and Jim Bradshaw
in and just before my trip
I hand entered my lines into Energy/EXDC from the original
pacelines on VAL2006-now called Val 4
I based my line selection on APV/CR and best of the last 3
spreed ratings . I would hace guessed you used the match up
but now I see I was wrong
I appreciate your nice words about me and the Methodology
but I am just a user of Doc's basic instructions as are written in the follow
up . Now really, I should understand those FPS readouts.
But I came into this long after they were what was taught and used
I am unable to make much out of the readouts your showing
That is me I am very interested and
If you want to discuss FPS numbers i have no problem with
you doing it here. I will look at it just like I look at the hat check area
and any other variation of what ever folks feel that will get them winners
If you want my work up of those readout you will need
to tell me the race and I will download the PP's
and work the race as I do every race everyday looking at what I need
and ignoring what I don't Thats me , I work each race with a very basic
approach as I have been doing for many years

This sight is what it is. If you don't like it then I am sorry
I try to keep it about winning and a positive feeling.
you are always welcome to do what ever you want
just be nice and try to keep with the motto Friends helping Friends

GS
Bill

[RichieP]

This racing "thing" we do can be brutal at times. Often the best laid plans and wagers wind up as torn up tickets,losses and frustration.

Over a year ago I was asked if I could REALLY handle losing if I was to switch to betting ONE horse. I said yes thinking HONESTLY "no sweat man". Well it has tested my makeup as a man MANY times in the last year. Racing tends to reveal all MY shortcomings and tests me constantly.

TODAY was such a day. I was playing races "live" with the Hat almost all afternoon. I lost and what made things worse was that my "other horse" won so many times it was unreal. To the point that if somehow I saw my way to play the "other horse" in the Bris contest I had a REAL chance to make the top 5. I am dead serious and the Hat KNOWS this. As it was I did TERRIBLY and lost fairly significant for the small bets I was making.

When I stopped round 4:30 to make supper he asked what I was gonna do tonight. I told him "bet Mnr and Ct and am gonna do the SAME darn thing I did today". He told me to FORGET the day session as it was OVER with and sessions like that happen to EVERYONE.

Tonight I just finished playing and doing the SAME things that failed me today I KILLED the 2 tracks mentioned. I mean KILLED them. Bombs,low payers. You name it I had them. I just sent Jim a copy of my Brisbet action for this evening to show that what he teaches about staying the course worked out.

What's the point? Frustration is a NORMAL part of this wonderful game. Anyone telling you they dont experience that and they play serious is full of ****.

Fwiw Pino is one the sharpest cappers and more importantly the KINDEST man one could know. I sincerely hope you stay around paisan becuase when you are straightened out I have learned a LOT from you personally. You KNOW that to be true.

Regardless your friendship as well as Bill and Jeff mean more than any stupid racing thing ever could ok? I mean that and would give anything if you,Jeff and Bill lived closer so we could meet up regularly. True REAL friends are PRICELESS in today's world of hustle and bustle.

"Tamuska" Pino! :)
Ciao
Richie and Mrs. Doris

[gl45]

Well said.

[gl45]

Bill,
Thanks, your post was clear enough.

[xtb]

I'm attaching a readouts. Can you select the winner? Is in feet per second.

I'll take a stab, the winner is horse #4.

54.80 57.70 54.47

[admin]

I'll take a stab, the winner is horse #4.

54.80 57.70 54.47

Hello xtb

I don't know but isnt it very rare that a
second fraction is that much faster then the first ??

54.80 57.70 54.47 ??

GS
Bill

[shoeless]

Pino,I might be wrong but from reading your post I get the feeling handicapping is no longer fun.With all the work you do it's no wonder keeping a database,looking for angles when do you look for pacelines.Remember how we used to just pick pacelines and go by SCBL look at all the big exactas we were hitting by just keeping it simple.I was doing the same as you looking for all the answers but you even told me THE MAIN THING IS PICKING THE RIGHT PACELINE.Now Im just concentrating on that and basically using Pizzolla's method of using the last paceline unless there is an excuse[off track,class rise too high,wrong distance].Im also using Forego's method[by way of Richie]of doing just races that I can setup as either early or other then early.Thanks to Houndog[who I cant thank enough] I have been able to triple my bank just using TPR numbers.Im still trying to incoroporate those numbers with other parts of the program.Anyway the main thing Im trying to say without all this rambling is keep it simple you will have more fun that way and hopefully pick up some cash as well.

Concerning the website Im not posting much these days.Everything seems to be geared towards RDSS which only a small cluster of people have.I personally dont feel this is way Doc Sartin would have done things but as Bill says it's up to me if I want to be part of the group or not.

Take Care.Jeff

[gl45]

xtb,
only 2 horses with 4 pacelines each.
I'm sure you did cap the race with BC method, and remember the words of wisdom " we want to find the horse that most likely will improve today".
I add total energy, who's the improving horse?

[mufasa]

xtb,
only 2 horses with 4 pacelines each.
I'm sure you did cap the race with BC method, and remember the words of wisdom " we want to find the horse that most likely will improve today".
I add total energy, who's the improving horse?

Not that anyone asked, I will take a plunge:

Horse #2 is improving as per the improving F2 FPS shown.

Robert

[gl45]

Robert,
You select the winner. Congrats.
Unfortunately you selected the wrong ones in real life, but that is handicapping, sometime we're right, some other times not.

[mufasa]

Robert,
You select the winner. Congrats.
Unfortunately you selected the wrong ones in real life, but that is handicapping, sometime we're right, some other times not.

I have many more times then not picked some losing horses but like I always like to say-I rather pick my own losers.

I tried to answer the question as to who was improving not who was going to win the race. Improvement is good but like anything else no guarantees in this pass time.

Robert

[gl45]

Jeff,
maybe you're right.
Thanks

[shoeless]

Pino,Your great with numbers and I feel that's the best part of your game.I remember that time we first all got together.You downloaded Delaware and you didnt have any database or angles.The first race you had a 200 ex and the last a 50-1 shot that won.Unfortunately you didnt play either of them but the point is they were right there on top without all this other mumbo jumbo.Jeff

[gl45]

great time, with great friends that don't ask.
Good bye Pace & Cap......was fun.

[xtb]

xtb,
only 2 horses with 4 pacelines each.
I'm sure you did cap the race with BC method, and remember the words of wisdom " we want to find the horse that most likely will improve today".
I add total energy, who's the improving horse?


I feel stupid now, I thought there were 8 horses. :D

What race was this?

[xtb]

Oh come on Pino, get back here!

[shoeless]

Bye Pino I will catch up with you down the road.Jeff

[mufasa]

great time, with great friends that don't ask.
Good bye Pace & Cap......was fun.

Before you go-just one question:

As to Sartin, Brohamer, Pizzolla, and Bradshaw how would you think that they made most of their money throughout their life: handicapping wagers or other?

None of them are or ever were professional handicapping betters only, right?

Thanks,

Robert

[admin]

[Concerning the website Im not posting much these days.Everything seems to be geared towards RDSS which only a small cluster of people have.I personally dont feel this is way Doc Sartin would have done things but as Bill says it's up to me if I want to be part of the group or not.

Take Care.Jeff


hello Jeff

I appreciate your support of Pace and Cap

GS
Bill

[Jonathan Steele]

Oh-oh, seems somebody stepped on somebody's toes. I'm not interested in the particulars, just sad to read that a long-time member and great 'capper is leaving.

Pino, I don't know what happened between you and certain folks on this board, and I'm not interested. All I ask is you reconsider before you make a hasty decision. It is my opinion that you have more to lose than you will gain (if you leave permanently).

Having said that, I wish you all the best.

Best regards,

Jon :D

[Jonathan Steele]

"great time, with great friends that don't ask."

Pino,

I think I'm starting to understand what the problem is. Rest assured that I WOULD PICK YOUR BRAIN and "ask," especially if you 'figured' out a race and I didn't! :)

All the best,

Jon :D

[froggy]

I get the feeling that some people feel that "Pace and Cap" is sort of turning into a RDSS site.
At the beginning of the year I didn't even have a program to use.
I wrote a poor mans version of Phase III for my 10 year old laptop
and went to the casino race book to work the races.
I got thrown out for having a communication device.
I then got out my old copy of "Pace Makes The Race" and copied the charts and took them to the book.
I got a steady 60% win and 7 out of 9 betting house Q,s.(does any body get any better with their newer programs?)
I wanted to get out of the smoke filled air and that is when I found "Pace and Cap".
Through Ted's generosity I got Spec160 on a free trial basis and that was the turning point in my handicapping .
I made printouts and went back to the book and started with $20 and have not looked back.
With Spec160 I made enough money to pay for a years license to continue using it.
I then asked Ted for a test copy of RDSS and have found it extremely easy to use (I'm a little on the lazy side).
With RDSS I have upped my win to about 64%, enough to justify the future price difference and since it is so much nicer to use I plan on keeping it.
This does not invalidate any of the older programs.
And if that is what you have and you are comfortable with it by all means use it and be proud.
There is so much here to learn and enjoy and edify yourself with.
For example the other day I was reading some 20yr old Huey Maul stuff and learned a go-no/go for betting.
Basically what Huey says that when you are betting 2 horses to win you are in effect betting an entry.
To figure out whether to bet or not all I have to do is multiply the odds and then divide by the sum of the odds and if it comes out to less than 1.5 then it a no-go. 3/1 times 4/1 divided by 7. (3 x 4 =12. 3 + 4 =7. 12/7 = 1.71)
Simple to do and it is making me money.
This is a place of learning even for us old dogs
There is so much here and so much to share with those that need help.
What a great group of folks.
I hope that one day I will be able to meet you all before I am too old to read the DRF.

Froggy

[Forego]

Concerning the website Im not posting much these days.Everything seems to be geared towards RDSS which only a small cluster of people have.I personally dont feel this is way Doc Sartin would have done things but as Bill says it's up to me if I want to be part of the group or not.
Take Care.Jeff

i see things a whole lot differently shoeless.

i am using val4 and have never been slighted or felt in the minority. i see folks using maxvel software making picks and participating in contests here. others are using energy or thoromation with freedom to do as they please. ramon 201 posts up valm readouts. finally synergism 2 and 4 are also being used by guys with nothing but encouragement from the members here.

regarding the software ted c is working on why wouldn't it be the "talk" here? for the first time the sartin codes and numbers are going to finally be part of a windows program. this is like 15 years overdue. to still be in dos mode is actually quite ridiculous in todays day and age.

having said that i am probably not going to use the new program. what i am doing right now is working fabulously and i am from the old school that says if it ain't broke don't fix it.

i congratulate you for your hard work and for growing your bankroll. i am very busy at work now but look forward to posting up more in a few weeks. please give partsnut my best wishes shoeless.

remember above all that God loves you
F.B.

[admin]

Thank you forego

[shoeless]

Forego,You know what your right.Im not going to use the program either so what do I care if everybody has it or not.Im using a 20 year old program that thanks to Houndog is giving me good results.This is Bill's site so I shouldnt be saying anything in the first place.Thanks for the help you have given me.I know you are a private person but maybe someday I will see you down the road as well.Jeff

[admin]

Hi Jeff

I think its its the group's site
You can say anything you want if its what you feel
as long as your polite, Which you sure are

We are very lucky to have so many good guys like forego
lets all work our own way and share what we can to help out

GS
Bill

[Fast4522]

Old / New or whatever:

My take on it is things evolve, and so does P & C. What some might use and others don't matters little. By Ted fixing Val and however the name was rendered, Val4 was a big plus for P & C. The fact this guy fixed the program and it was given out to all, was less sect like and more group like! This in itself is direct evidence of this site moving to the plus. With a mans work there free to evaluate and to continue to use (Val4), what better way to show everyone that your work is top shelf.

[admin]

Thanks Forego and Fast

I think it was very big of Ted to give us Val 4
I have lots of confidence in Ted if he is that confident
in his work. Rdss is in the test versions
and I am having issues with it for various reasons
I think its very high class that Ted wants us to openly work out the bugs
I am honored that he does it here

The mike is always open
we all are guest speakers at our own seminars

GS
Bill