Pace and Cap - Sartin Methodology & The Match Up - View Single Post

Tim Y · 08-27-2008, 12:33 AM

When the truck drivers did their initial work they found THREE, out of the many factors studied, that were stand alone evaluations:
1) EP or velocity to the 2nd call
2) SP, which is not surprising as it is made up of EP
3) Average pace a compounded rating, as I recall, this one was only indicative in sprints (Fuzzy here but that's the one I recall).

I have hundreds of 20 race cycle sheets around, and, not too strangely, find NO column on them which is used for F1 as a handicapping factor.

Now coming from a guy who, as Richie one time pointed out, "never met an early horse he didn't like," I have reviewed more than my share of the earlier parts of races from the thousands of races I have put through the computer back to the days of ENGEN, KGEN, and Phase III.

Now I have heard some anthropomorphize, and try to feed me the concept that horses are showing some kind of "courage" or "fighting spirit" when they go head to head early. Horses run out of fear: they have evolved an effective, hard wired instinct of "fight or flight" from predecessor forms (Eohippus for one) in getting away from predators.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horse_behavior QUOTE:"Other instinctive traits, such as running away when frightened, bucking off anything that lands on a horse's back (like a mountain lion or other predator), or never entering a small enclosed area, also have to be overcome before the horse is useful to humans" All aspects that a race brings out to start the fear cycle.

http://www.extension.org/pages/Horse...light_Instinct
QUOTE:"Horses evolved from small mammals whose survival depended on their ability to flee from predators. This basic survival mechanism still is ingrained in the modern horse. Although we have removed most of the predators from the life of the domestic horse, its first instinct when frightened is to run away from the frightening stimulus. If running is not possible then the horse resorts to biting, kicking, striking or rearing to protect itself. Many of the horse’s natural behavior patterns, such as forming herds and performing the same activities as other horses in their herd, relate directly to their prey status."

They evolved the ability of escape through a nimble, speedy mechanism supported by natural stamina and lung capacity. Both the famous animal behaviorist Konrad Lorenz and (the Naked Ape author) Desmond Morris (in this great book Horsewatching), outline how these instincts come about in animals, and how the adapt to differing circumstances. From the day they are born, horses instinctively try to remove ANY object on their backs as they are perceived as predators. In the earliest stages of conditioning, yearlings will try to extricate themselves from saddles and then later to the weight of a man (they usually lay across the back quietly called bellying). Even later, when training has "calmed" some of that "fight or flight," the race atmosphere does everything to re-initiate it again by the loud clang of the bell at the start, the riders whooping an hollering out of the gate, AND the stinging slap on the backside, which no horse can differentiate from the instinctual maneuver of fear that there is a predator there. Even later in a contest,when the rider is showing the whip along the sides of the head, they continue on out of conditioned fear.

Look at the body language of a horse quietly grazing or meandering around a field, versus the wild eyed look when they load (you usually cannot see the lighter sclera around a horse's eyes unless they are frightened and you see it often at the time they load into the gate). This is after the pre-race workout has gotten them keyed up. Then, confine them in a very small space (which almost no horse handles well), and the evolutionary mechanisms are all "on" when they are "released" into the race. It is only as they mature that a little of this calms down, but in many animals it never does and they stand there waiting to be loaded a trembling, wet mess, often quivering with those eyes very wide open.

08-27-2008, 12:33 AM	#71
Tim Y turf historian Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 6,455	from the beginning When the truck drivers did their initial work they found THREE, out of the many factors studied, that were stand alone evaluations: 1) EP or velocity to the 2nd call 2) SP, which is not surprising as it is made up of EP 3) Average pace a compounded rating, as I recall, this one was only indicative in sprints (Fuzzy here but that's the one I recall). I have hundreds of 20 race cycle sheets around, and, not too strangely, find NO column on them which is used for F1 as a handicapping factor. Now coming from a guy who, as Richie one time pointed out, "never met an early horse he didn't like," I have reviewed more than my share of the earlier parts of races from the thousands of races I have put through the computer back to the days of ENGEN, KGEN, and Phase III. Now I have heard some anthropomorphize, and try to feed me the concept that horses are showing some kind of "courage" or "fighting spirit" when they go head to head early. Horses run out of fear: they have evolved an effective, hard wired instinct of "fight or flight" from predecessor forms (Eohippus for one) in getting away from predators. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horse_behavior QUOTE:"Other instinctive traits, such as running away when frightened, bucking off anything that lands on a horse's back (like a mountain lion or other predator), or never entering a small enclosed area, also have to be overcome before the horse is useful to humans" All aspects that a race brings out to start the fear cycle. http://www.extension.org/pages/Horse...light_Instinct QUOTE:"Horses evolved from small mammals whose survival depended on their ability to flee from predators. This basic survival mechanism still is ingrained in the modern horse. Although we have removed most of the predators from the life of the domestic horse, its first instinct when frightened is to run away from the frightening stimulus. If running is not possible then the horse resorts to biting, kicking, striking or rearing to protect itself. Many of the horse’s natural behavior patterns, such as forming herds and performing the same activities as other horses in their herd, relate directly to their prey status." They evolved the ability of escape through a nimble, speedy mechanism supported by natural stamina and lung capacity. Both the famous animal behaviorist Konrad Lorenz and (the Naked Ape author) Desmond Morris (in this great book Horsewatching), outline how these instincts come about in animals, and how the adapt to differing circumstances. From the day they are born, horses instinctively try to remove ANY object on their backs as they are perceived as predators. In the earliest stages of conditioning, yearlings will try to extricate themselves from saddles and then later to the weight of a man (they usually lay across the back quietly called bellying). Even later, when training has "calmed" some of that "fight or flight," the race atmosphere does everything to re-initiate it again by the loud clang of the bell at the start, the riders whooping an hollering out of the gate, AND the stinging slap on the backside, which no horse can differentiate from the instinctual maneuver of fear that there is a predator there. Even later in a contest,when the rider is showing the whip along the sides of the head, they continue on out of conditioned fear. Look at the body language of a horse quietly grazing or meandering around a field, versus the wild eyed look when they load (you usually cannot see the lighter sclera around a horse's eyes unless they are frightened and you see it often at the time they load into the gate). This is after the pre-race workout has gotten them keyed up. Then, confine them in a very small space (which almost no horse handles well), and the evolutionary mechanisms are all "on" when they are "released" into the race. It is only as they mature that a little of this calms down, but in many animals it never does and they stand there waiting to be loaded a trembling, wet mess, often quivering with those eyes very wide open. Last edited by Tim Y; 08-27-2008 at 12:44 AM.