Go Back   Pace and Cap - Sartin Methodology & The Match Up > Pace Makes the Race / TPR
Mark Forums Read
Google Site Search Get RDSS Sartin Library RDSS FAQs Conduct Register Site FAQ Members List Search Today's Posts

Pace Makes the Race / TPR Discussion, Examples, Lessons from Total Pace Ratings (TPR) aka 'Phase I' from the book 'Pace Makes the Race'

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-24-2017, 09:02 PM   #1
shoeless
Grade 1
 
shoeless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,149
FTL Paceline selection ?

FTL

In order what are the 5 most important things you do
when you are picking pace lines

Jeff
shoeless is offline  
Old 08-24-2017, 09:23 PM   #2
Jeebs
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 909
Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeless View Post
FTL

In order what are the 5 most important things you do
when you are picking pace lines

Jeff
Jeff, here is an excerpt from a PM that FTL sent me several months ago. This should shed light on your question. Good luck!

Quote:
I suggest you change the way you approach a race to the following.
1 – if you want to take my advice, throw out any horse that has not run in the last 90 days. Those horses win 5% or less of the races.
Then, throw out any horse with a ML of 20/1 or greater. Again, those horses win 5% or less of the races.
2 – read the conditions
3 – select a line for each horse that has a qualifying race, i.e.
a – last line is a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd (a “+” race) and is the same distance, surface or
b – last line the horse was 1st or close 2nd at the first and/or second call (a “(+)” race) even if it faded in the stretch and is the same distance, surface
c - last line the horse made up lengths between first call and second call to be within 2 lengths of the leader at the second call (a “(+)” race) even if it faded in the stretch and is the same distance, surface
In its’ last race, if a horse ran a “0” race and the race was the same distance, surface and similar class level and there was no “valid” reason for the bad effort, eliminate the horse from further consideration. A “valid” reason would be “trouble or off track”.
If in its’ last race the horse ran the wrong distance, wrong surface, higher class level, had trouble or on an OFF track, go back to the next line and follow the same guidelines.
In my own work I would not use a line that is more than 90 days old “IF” I legitimately got back that far. 90 days gives the horse many races to look at. That’s one race every 18 days. If the horse isn’t sound enough to keep that kind of schedule then there is probably something wrong with the horse.
NEVER USE a sprint line in a route race.
NEVER USE a route line in a sprint race.

Once contenders and lines have been selected, look first at the “original” screen. It is on this screen that you can see the different running styles. It is on this screen that you can see the class levels they were able to successfully (in one form or another) race at and compare those class levels to today’s. It is on this screen where you can see the mixture of running styles in the race, which will give you a better idea of how the race will unfold.
Jeebs is offline  
Old 08-25-2017, 04:36 PM   #3
dlivery
Grade 1
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Thornhill ON
Posts: 437
Nice to get back to where it all starts Basics 1,2,3

Thanks for the reminder of what and where we need too draw a line through
This is such a good remider of what we all need to do are read the conditions
or when the conditions are starting to get muddy and not clear
I would pass the race as I m not sure where to look for a winner when it starts to get unclear

Next Race

As Bill V would say onward and forward and good skill.
__________________
May all wagers be Winners...
dlivery is offline  
Old 08-25-2017, 06:29 PM   #4
Lt1
Grade 1
 
Lt1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Valley Stream NY
Posts: 9,037
For those who maybe having problems with paceline selection may I suggest reading Follow Up 81 the publishers section where Doc explains the modern day Methodology approach. Also go to the video section and watch the Docs'1998 one on one video seminar consisting of 3 vids and a carefully explained step by step approach. It should answer most the questions you may have.
Tim
__________________
Trust but verify
Lt1 is offline  
Old 08-25-2017, 08:56 PM   #5
Lt1
Grade 1
 
Lt1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Valley Stream NY
Posts: 9,037
Another excellent source to check out are the Brohamer audio tapes. Tom provides his method of contender & paceline selections.
Tim
__________________
Trust but verify
Lt1 is offline  
Old 08-30-2017, 07:52 PM   #6
For The Lead
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,292
Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeless View Post
FTL

In order what are the 5 most important things you do
when you are picking pace lines

Jeff
Shoeless,

Although Jeebs answered your question directed to me, for me, let me offer this; go to this link http://paceandcap.com/forums/forumdi...116&order=desc where you will find races I posted that start at the beginning and go to the end, including a rundown on each horse. As I recall, you will also find the PP’s for every horse in the race so you can look at them and follow along. You will probably need to go back to page 3 or 4 pages since it has been 3 or 4 years since I posted on a regular basis. Just find my posts and read through them. They are all done the same way so it should be easy for you to follow.

Now, I have a question for you.
I seem to recall that in a post I read somewhere, you use ENERGY.
There is more than one ENERGY program. Which one do you use? The one WITH BL/BL or the one WITHOUT?
__________________
"It's suppose to be hard. If it was easy, everybody would do it." Jimmy Dugan, A League of Their Own
For The Lead is offline  
Old 09-01-2017, 10:51 PM   #7
shoeless
Grade 1
 
shoeless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,149
Hi FTL

Thanks for the link

I am using the one without, pretty sure it is Energy V

I did not realize they had one with it

Jeff
shoeless is offline  
Old 09-02-2017, 02:30 AM   #8
For The Lead
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,292
Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeless View Post
Hi FTL

Thanks for the link

I am using the one without, pretty sure it is Energy V

I did not realize they had one with it

Jeff
When I load ENERGY, here is the first screen that comes up.
There is no BL/BL, no line score (LS) and no thoromation.
When I get a couple of minutes I'll put up a recent race for you.
Attached Images
 
__________________
"It's suppose to be hard. If it was easy, everybody would do it." Jimmy Dugan, A League of Their Own
For The Lead is offline  
Old 09-02-2017, 08:47 AM   #9
Bill V.
The egg man
 
Bill V.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Carlsbad, California
Posts: 10,005
Energy

FTL I am Looking forward to your race demo

Jeff is a very good user of Energy He sends me good reports
all the time,

Jeff and FTL There are many versions of energy floating around
Just because your main menu screen might look the same,
Jim Bradshaw was always tweaking the program adding new readouts or
changing the algorithms.
He also would make custom copies, That is why some people have energy
in a 3 call format where the entry screen looked like this


Name:  Entry.JPG
Views: 2474
Size:  25.4 KB

Most copies use the 4 call format

i have a version called EXDC. It has just about every thing Energy, Phase 1, Entropy ,Thromation and an odds line generator

Jim Bradshaw just kept adding readouts and combining programs if a client wanted it.

Energy and KGEN were awesome programs

Bill
Bill V. is offline  
Old 09-02-2017, 10:28 AM   #10
shoeless
Grade 1
 
shoeless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,149
FTL and Bill

I am using the 3 call version and the opening screen looks the same

FTL I as well would be interested to see how you go about using the
energy program if you wouldn't mind doing so.

Jeff
shoeless is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Paceline Selection - some observation Jeebs Sartin Methodology Handicapping 101 (102 ...) 16 04-04-2017 04:19 PM
Question on Paceline Selection - DMR0828 R2 kpmats10 Sartin Methodology Handicapping 101 (102 ...) 5 09-09-2016 08:29 AM
Paceline Selection Ted Craven RDSS 4 01-27-2011 01:41 PM
Paceline Selection Strategies Ted Craven RDSS 5 09-30-2010 01:48 PM


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:39 PM.