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Old 02-23-2017, 10:53 AM   #31
Tim Y
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NO ONE is lost, but yours truly had done what most people do in life:FIND the way that works and use it. Enlightening others to new discoveries is no crime.

Again there is NO ONE WAY TO DO ANYTHING from putting in the toilet paper roll or finding an effective way to use a tool.

"There are NO rules," has been the mantra of this methodology since day one. I advise you to recall that.
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Old 02-23-2017, 01:40 PM   #32
Lt1
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Hi Bill. I totally agree that RDSS is equally effective no matter where you play. True some track like OP maybe a little more difficult but each user is responsible for keeping records and knowing what goes on at the track[s] they wager on. I personally have score some very nice hits with horses shipping from Parx to the NYRA circuit. Ramon Preciado has shipped several horses into NY stakes and scored very nicely. In my opinion it is almost impossible not to win with RDSS when proper contenders and pacelines are entered.
Tim G
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Old 02-23-2017, 01:46 PM   #33
Bill V.
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You are lost

I respectfully stand by my opinion that you are lost

I have asked you time and time again, that if you have something to say
against Doc and the methodology ,please start and preach your opinions in your own threads, and please stop hijacking every topic with your anti Doc/Methodology tone

Yet you ignore me, You merely jump into every topic, with the same
anti methodology tone, then the tired and worn out " NO ONE WAY TO DO ANYTHING"

I agree there are many ways, In the last week I have demonstrated how I use RDSS, Phase 1, KGEN, Val 4 and Energy, Each program needs special
knowledge. However each program gives out different information, The common thing is IF you follow Doc's guidelines and enter proper pace lines and contenders you will win.
I have also put out my spreadsheet of the factors,, because Jeebs asked a direct question, what
factors should he pay attention to, Since he was brave enough to post two races before the fact, in his own thread, I replied, You however have not put anything out that can actually help. Just your opinion that things don't work.
I don't see why everything has to turn into a anti Methodology/Doc invitation to you

Since you are so sure of your anti Doc/methodology feelings, Why don't you past a race before the fact and show how the readouts are wrong,

I can answer the question very easily. If you put in poor pacelines
and you lose. we can see your pacelines and rerun the race. Then by following Doc's guidelines we probably will win that same race about 90% of the time.

I think you know this

Bill
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Old 02-23-2017, 01:49 PM   #34
Bill V.
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Agree

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt1 View Post
Hi Bill. I totally agree that RDSS is equally effective no matter where you play. True some track like OP maybe a little more difficult but each user is responsible for keeping records and knowing what goes on at the track[s] they wager on. I personally have score some very nice hits with horses shipping from Parx to the NYRA circuit. Ramon Preciado has shipped several horses into NY stakes and scored very nicely. In my opinion it is almost impossible not to win with RDSS when proper contenders and pacelines are entered.
Tim G
I agree Tim G You want to win and you know in your gut you are a winner
So you look at each race no matter where, and say I CAN win this race

Good For You

Keep us posted I know you are an ACE

Bill
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:01 PM   #35
Lt1
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Thanks for the kind words but in true I'm far from being an ace. We all lose races but in my case it usually happens when I either get lazy or tweak the tier rankings based on some other factors I employ. In the long run however I truly believe all of us can and should make consistent profit. As Doc always said don't judge success or failure one 1 day of handicapping. Newer members should keep those 20 race cycles records and they will begin to see that they are doing better then they think. If you also record the types of races you win or lose you can accent where you are strong and work on where you are weak.
Tim G
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Old 02-23-2017, 05:03 PM   #36
Jeebs
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Bill,

There are races where inevitably, other factors will win out over pace velocity and energy. Even you have said this. Understanding that aspect of the game has made it easier to shake off the times where proper paceline and contender selection will fail. One example was a race yesterday at Tampa (4th) 1m40yd route. The winner (6 horse) has no route lines. No recent + lines. Even if I plugged each of those lines in and let the comluter rank them, its total energy adjusted and other factors on BL/BL and V/DC ranked at the bottom. It did run against fast paced sprint calls in its previous outs, so perhaps it needed to stretch out and attack a slower paced race. Unfortunately, no computer readout could have predicted a successful stretchout. Shrug your shoulders and move on. Same race, the 7 at boxcars, top ranked EPR and likely pacesetter ranked bottom TE and BL/BL. Also a M% in the 70's. Not a Win contender but would have made a great Place or Show tool. Paid I think $47.60 to Place.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill V. View Post
I respectfully stand by my opinion that you are lost

I have asked you time and time again, that if you have something to say
against Doc and the methodology ,please start and preach your opinions in your own threads, and please stop hijacking every topic with your anti Doc/Methodology tone

Yet you ignore me, You merely jump into every topic, with the same
anti methodology tone, then the tired and worn out " NO ONE WAY TO DO ANYTHING"

I agree there are many ways, In the last week I have demonstrated how I use RDSS, Phase 1, KGEN, Val 4 and Energy, Each program needs special
knowledge. However each program gives out different information, The common thing is IF you follow Doc's guidelines and enter proper pace lines and contenders you will win.
I have also put out my spreadsheet of the factors,, because Jeebs asked a direct question, what
factors should he pay attention to, Since he was brave enough to post two races before the fact, in his own thread, I replied, You however have not put anything out that can actually help. Just your opinion that things don't work.
I don't see why everything has to turn into a anti Methodology/Doc invitation to you

Since you are so sure of your anti Doc/methodology feelings, Why don't you past a race before the fact and show how the readouts are wrong,

I can answer the question very easily. If you put in poor pacelines
and you lose. we can see your pacelines and rerun the race. Then by following Doc's guidelines we probably will win that same race about 90% of the time.

I think you know this

Bill
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Old 02-23-2017, 06:42 PM   #37
Lt1
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Hi Jeebs. That was one of those races where a jumped up and did something it hadn't done before. I had the 6 ranked 7th and last on bl/bl and and 6th on rx3. I didn't have the 7 as a contender. As you stated next race.
Tim G
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Old 02-23-2017, 07:04 PM   #38
Jeebs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt1 View Post
Hi Jeebs. That was one of those races where a jumped up and did something it hadn't done before. I had the 6 ranked 7th and last on bl/bl and and 6th on rx3. I didn't have the 7 as a contender. As you stated next race.
Tim G
I didn't rate it a paceline in my contender process. I know RichieP says to watch for sprinters up against fast paces stretching out but again, its TE didn't scream route. Only after the fact did I compare it. That 7 as a bottom tier was only worth it under due to its early pace rank. For full disclosure, I didn't play that horse under. Nonetheless, I felt comfortable with my lines.
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Old 02-23-2017, 10:02 PM   #39
Bill V.
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so

Jeebs I just looked at the race

Before I get into this race, The point we are trying to teach is, Yes there are races we can not get with readouts alone. I know this . But some skill in handicapping will tell us why, or help us pass problem races.

The problem with getting your mind contaminated by lost souls is we then
focus on the races we lose and then we play the blame game.

The program can only function with pace lines that you select

now to the race

This is a CL8000 N2L for 4+ F


Female horse running for a 8000 tag should tell you these are not champions
The first thing i looked at was the life time records

I then look for recent + races at todays distance and surface
Lastly, since this is a non winner of 2 life, I look to see the class of their maiden wins.

Lets face it, The only 2 horses with + pacelines routing are the 3 and the 8
1.6/1 and 3/1

Here are my notes

Horse 1 . 1 for12 Only shows 1 plus races dirt routing on a off track
its only win was at 7.5 on the turf
Horse 2 1 for 10 Show no dirt route plus pacelines. Its only win was its last line a 7.0 dirt sprint as a MC8. Today's race is a 8000 claimer n2-L
Horse 3. 1 for 6 Shows 2 plus lines dirt routing Contender
I would use line 1
Horse 4 1 for 18 Shows No plus line dirt routing Its win line is line 9
a 7.5 turf route
Horse 5 1 for 29! Shows 4 + dirt routes but it"s only win was 1 year ago
in a MC 8. It is 1 for 29 and has been beaten by 45 lengths in its last 3 races 2 of them at this same class.
Horse 6 1 for 3 Its win was its first race MC 16 at GP
It has never routed.
Horse 7 1 for 12 Shows no plus races dirt routing. Its win was a state bred MC12.5
Horse 8 ML favorite 1 for 11 Last 3 races are plus races dirt routing It's maiden win was a MC 12.5
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