Go Back   Pace and Cap - Sartin Methodology & The Match Up > General Discussion
Mark Forums Read
Google Site Search Get RDSS Sartin Library RDSS FAQs Conduct Register Site FAQ Members List Search Today's Posts

General Discussion General Horse Racing Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-26-2014, 09:27 AM   #1
DontSayDont
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 106
Apology

In the thread Ote, started by Segwin, I made a statement to the effect "5 furlong turf races at GP are always run on the "outer turf course". That is incorrect. They run the 5 furlong and mile races (I haven't check on others) on both courses. Yesterday, while imputing information from the results files I noticed that in back to back 5 furlong turf races that they were run on different portions of the turf course. The information I save unfortunately doesn't include the distance from rail for the races.

I apologize for the misleading information and will attempt to do better in future posts.

Ray
DontSayDont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2014, 09:41 AM   #2
atkinsrr
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 507
Dear Don'tSayDon't...GP doesn't have 2 turf courses...but in some races they move the rail out so far that when you are viewing the race on a screen or TV it looks as tho they have another Turf course...that turf course is extremely wide which gives them the option of moving that rail in and out to keep the course in good shape....I wish FG would do that because the Turf Course at FG is a total disaster
atkinsrr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2014, 10:12 AM   #3
DontSayDont
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by atkinsrr View Post
Dear Don'tSayDon't...GP doesn't have 2 turf courses...but in some races they move the rail out so far that when you are viewing the race on a screen or TV it looks as tho they have another Turf course...that turf course is extremely wide which gives them the option of moving that rail in and out to keep the course in good shape....I wish FG would do that because the Turf Course at FG is a total disaster
Yes they only have one turf course but the way they are segregating it seem to make it work like 2 courses. That is the reason I use "outer" or "inner". Either on the course they make from the farthest out rails and one for the nearest in rails.

I think it would be hard for GP to move the rails between races. I don't recall the exact races but it would be like race 7, 5F turf, rail set at 108ft, then the very next race, race 8, 5F turf, rail set at 48ft. It seems they are dividing the main turf course and making it 2 semi different courses on the same main course. I haven't watched enough races to determine if that is a fact. Or do they actually move the rails between races?

I understand the reason for moving the rails in and out to prevent more damage to the inner portion of the turf course. But it seems GP is doing slightly more than that. Hence I think they should quantify the 2 different courses that they are creating.

Anyone have more information on this point? I for one would like to know.

Ray

ps. Thanks for the reply atkinsrr
DontSayDont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2014, 09:38 PM   #4
dirty moose
Grade 1
 
dirty moose's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: NY
Posts: 455
It's the biggest crock o' sheeeet in racing. It's 2 courses. They don't report as 2. GP is as shady as they come,if you ask me.
dirty moose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2014, 03:52 PM   #5
MikeB
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 154
Another problem with turf races at GP is run-ups. I'm new here and not familiar with forum policy about links to other sites, but here goes.

Andy Beyer wrote a couple of articles about the problems with unknown or varying run-up distances. One of them is HERE. He talks about a 7 1/2 furlong race at GP with a 375 foot run-up, making it longer than a 1m 40yd race.

That article has a link to a previous article by Beyer on the subject.
MikeB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2014, 04:37 PM   #6
Bill V.
The egg man
 
Bill V.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Carlsbad, California
Posts: 10,005
welcome

Hello Mike B

Welcome to pace and cap

Thank you for the link, and your nice post so far.
I also thank you for your thoughtfulness to inquire about posting links


Good Skilll
Bill V.


^^
Bill V. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2014, 06:42 PM   #7
atkinsrr
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 507
MikeB..I also read Beyers article....actually the run ups for 71/2 on the Turf are only 250 feet ,,,I didn't see anything about 375..unless he wrote another article...I'm just wondering if Track Master knows this and can do something about adjusting the numbers...it's probably best to stay away from those races at 71/2 F
atkinsrr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2014, 06:52 PM   #8
atkinsrr
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 507
Also MikeB you'll notice on turf racing at AP FG MTH they run about distances on the turf and when the PP's come out (especially MTH..you can't use those pacelines because the track won't give you interior fractions and we can't get pace ratings on that line. I've sent letters to Steven Crist at DRF, sent letters also to MTH and FG and I can't get tracks to put fractions in these races...I mean come on It doesn't matter the distance ...if a horse runs a 44 half at an about sprint it's the same 44 as if the horse ran at 5F or 51/2F. MTH told me when I called them they said they couldn't get the clockers to do it ?????
ummm couldn't or wouldn't...it seems a lot of these tracks do not care about the bettors, who are paying the way......just sayin'
atkinsrr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2014, 06:52 PM   #9
MikeB
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 154
Quote:
Originally Posted by atkinsrr View Post
MikeB..I also read Beyers article....actually the run ups for 71/2 on the Turf are only 250 feet ,,,I didn't see anything about 375..unless he wrote another article...I'm just wondering if Track Master knows this and can do something about adjusting the numbers...it's probably best to stay away from those races at 71/2 F
There were two articles about run-ups. The one I linked to in my previous post said:

Quote:
In recent weeks, the official Equibase charts have said there was a 250-foot run-up for many 7 1/2 furlong races — meaning that the field covered 250 feet before the timing of the race begins. But the 250-foot figure happens to be the maximum number that the Equibase data system can accommodate. (Presumably the programmers thought a longer run-up was unimaginable.) For Band of Joy’s race, the footnotes to the chart added this clarification: “The run-up for this race was 375 feet.”
MikeB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2014, 07:30 PM   #10
atkinsrr
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 507
Thanks Mike...I didn't see that..
atkinsrr is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Apology To All partsnut General Discussion 14 09-19-2008 05:14 AM


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:23 PM.