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Old 01-17-2012, 07:37 PM   #1
Charlesg95
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TrackMaster Class Ratings

Does anyone have a basic theory on how to rate the class ratings in the RDSS programs that come from TrackMaster? What I am try to determine is what the spread is for horses to be considered the same class. When I read the information on TrackMaster's site, they give examples of horses that are 1 or 2 points apart and the horses are considered to be changing class. Based on what I have seen however, this is not the case and the spread is larger than 1 or 2.
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Old 01-17-2012, 10:19 PM   #2
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Does anyone have a basic theory on how to rate the class ratings in the RDSS programs that come from TrackMaster? What I am try to determine is what the spread is for horses to be considered the same class. When I read the information on TrackMaster's site, they give examples of horses that are 1 or 2 points apart and the horses are considered to be changing class. Based on what I have seen however, this is not the case and the spread is larger than 1 or 2.
Without benefit of seeing how you arrived at your conclusion, I can only offer the following two points.

1 - Likely, the following is what you read on their site.

"Class Rating

Class ratings are on a scale from 30 to 130 reflecting the difficulty of the race. A top class (minor Stakes) race might have a class rating (abbreviated CR) of 100; a $10,000 Claiming race might have a CR of 70. By comparing the CR of today’s race and the CR for each horse’s recent races you will know if the horse is moving up or down in class ¾ that is, if he is in an easier or more difficult race than he has been in recently. The calculation of class rating includes a weight for the track so you can compare class ratings between races at different tracks. An 80 at Aqueduct is equivalent to an 80 at Belmont and an 80 at Philadelphia Park. A horse that has been successful in races with a CR of 90 at Churchill Downs should be competitive in a race with a CR of 90 at Aqueduct.

Class ratings are given for each race, and several class ratings are shown for each horse, including the ratings of his last three races, an Average class rating, his highest-class rating, etc. This allows you to judge whether a horse is moving up or down in class. That is, whether this race is more difficult or easier than the races he has been competing in recently."


2 - I have been using Trackmaster for almost 15 years now on a daily basis and I find their product to be of good quality, reliable and informative.

If you don't mind taking a minute to comply, I would be interested in seeing how you arrived at your conclusion.
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Old 01-18-2012, 01:38 PM   #3
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TrackMaster Class Ratings

First, let me say that I am not doubting the validity of the TrackMaster class ratings.

What I was trying to determine is what type of spread individuals may be using to determine horses within the same class level. Is the spread 5 to 7, 1 to 3, 5 to 10? I ask because as I have been handicapping and see horses at say an 80 class level running in a 20K NW3-L race dropping to 10K NW3-L at a different track but the class rating is 77 at the new track. The drop in claiming value makes me cringe (sore, injury, etc...) especially if the horse was competive at the 20K level. However, since the class ratings are fairly close, one could assume that the horse is basically running against similar horses. You can then reverse what I just said and the horse goes from 10K to 20K but the level is basically the same. (NOTE: I am aware that the class level at tracks differ and a 10K race at one track is not the same as a 10K race at another and that is the benefit of having the TrackMaster class ratings.) So, I am looking for a basic (not hard and fast) value to say if a horse is within "X" points, the horse is running against the same class.

As for where I retrieved the information referencing 1 or 2 points, it was within the documentation of one programs listed on TrackMasters site. I saw the information posted earlier in this thread but it did not really answer what I was looking for. So, I examined some of the documentation related to other programs that used TrackMaster values and derived my comment from there. (NOTE: My assumption was that the program did not modify the value and you know what that gets you some times.)
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Old 01-18-2012, 01:51 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Charlesg95 View Post
First, let me say that I am not doubting the validity of the TrackMaster class ratings.
Hi Charles,
Please be aware that the "CR" is a Trackmaster and NOT a Sartin Methodology readout.

IF it is similar to the old "PR" (Power Rating) that TM put out you can read Doc Sartin's opinion of it on page 5 of Followup #84. To say he had NO use for it would be an understatement as you will see. If it is NOT similar than disregard everything in this paragraph.

Best of luck/skill
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Old 01-18-2012, 02:37 PM   #5
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Just to be clear - I believe you are referring to the number from TrackMaster showing in RDSS as RC (Race Class) on the Original and Adjusted Screen for each race, and not the numbers captioned CR (Class Rating), found on the Entries Ccreen and elsewhere, which are calculated internally and related to Earnings, and Consistency for a horse.

For the record, TrackMaster's Race Class (RC) figure is in RDSS because it was in Speculator, or Validator. Even at that, it was not a readout used or recommended by Dr Sartin, as Richie mentions. FWIW, I make no reference to it at all in my own handicapping.

The RC figure, like the TrackMaster SR figure (and the DTV and ITV figures) is based on final time speed analysis. We know that $5000 claimers can finish a race sometimes in the same speed as $20,000 claimers. That does not imply that horses who compete well in $5000 claimers will typically be competitive against successful $20,000 claimers (mostly they won't).

I will leave it to others to make a coherent case for a consistent usefulness of these RC numbers in comparing one horse's race to another horse's race. But you will not be worse off by ignoring these numbers, IMO.

Ted
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Old 01-18-2012, 08:06 PM   #6
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Just to be clear, I am refering to the RC value and not the CR value.

The reason why I have been looking at it is to help determine the difference of the class levels at different tracks. Since I tend to handicap races at several different tracks on different circuits, I do not really have a home track(s). Thus, I do not tend to keep detail records and track models for the tracks I am betting since they change frequently.
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Old 01-18-2012, 08:51 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by RichieP View Post
Hi Charles,
Please be aware that the "CR" is a Trackmaster and NOT a Sartin Methodology readout.

IF it is similar to the old "PR" (Power Rating) that TM put out you can read Doc Sartin's opinion of it on page 5 of Followup #84. To say he had NO use for it would be an understatement as you will see. If it is NOT similar than disregard everything in this paragraph.

Best of luck/skill
The Trackmaster "power rating" is NOT similar to the "race class rating". They are two DIFFERENT things, so the above CAN BE disregarded. Trackmaster did not "trade in" the "old power rating" for a newer "race class rating". Trackmaster continues to produce a "power rating" along with a "class rating".
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Old 01-18-2012, 08:59 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Charlesg95 View Post
Just to be clear, I am refering to the RC value and not the CR value.

The reason why I have been looking at it is to help determine the difference of the class levels at different tracks. Since I tend to handicap races at several different tracks on different circuits, I do not really have a home track(s). Thus, I do not tend to keep detail records and track models for the tracks I am betting since they change frequently.
As I said in my earlier post, I have been downloading files from Trackmaster every single day for almost 15 years. As a result I have built a database that now exceeds 5,000,000 horses and 600,000 races.

Initially I was curious to know how you arrived at your conclusions. If you try to make sense of, as an example, the claiming price of a race as compared to the Trackmaster "race class" I doubt that you will be successful.

Here is something I think will help you. I took this from a typical year which contains more than 40,000 races and winners. I will start with winners that were 5 Trackmaster Race Class Points higher than the Race Class of today's race and continue to show the results one point at a time down to 5 Trackmaster Race Class Points below today's race class.

Last race is 5 pts higher than today's race class....= 817 winners
.................4 pts................................................. = 1417 winners
.................3 pts................................................. = 2586 winners
.................2 pts................................................. = 3096 winners
.................1 pt................................................... = 3206 winners
Last race race class is equal to today's race class. = 9593 winners
Last race is 1 pt lower than today's race class..... = 4400 winners
.............2 pts..................................................... = 3685 winners
.............3 pts..................................................... = 2478 winners
.............4 pts..................................................... = 1777 winners
.............5 pts..................................................... = 1343 winners


The remaining winners fall outside of the guidelines shown above and the further away from "center" you get, the lower the number.

Having said all of the above, I'm still not clear on how you are using it.
I am not an RDSS user, but from what I have seen from various screen shots on the site, although the "race class" for the race is shown, the previous "race classes" for each horses previous races are not shown, so there is no way to make a comparison.

At any rate, I hope this is of some help to you.
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Old 01-18-2012, 11:07 PM   #9
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For the Lead: Thanks for the information relating to the 40,000 races and the breakdown for 5 levels above and below the class level of today's race. The interesting thing is that showed 84% winners were in the range but it was not what I was looking for.

RichieP: The RC value in the RDSS program is what I am referring to and it is the TrackMaster Race Class (I believe) and not the TrackMaster Power Rating.

I appreciate all the comments but I guess I am not real clear on what I was trying to derive. So, I am going to close the thread to limit any confusion for others in the future.

Thanks again
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Old 01-19-2012, 07:13 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by For The Lead View Post
I am not an RDSS user, but from what I have seen from various screen shots on the site, although the "race class" for the race is shown, the previous "race classes" for each horses previous races are not shown, so there is no way to make a comparison.
In RDSS2, the RC figure for each past race of a horse is shown on the Original and Adjusted Screes under the column heading RC.

In RDSS1, it is shown on the Adjusted Screen.

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