NewPace / RDSS

[mikesal57]

Originally Posted by SilentRun

Yes I can....Here are 6 races from my records that I won using New Pace concepts in conjunction with RDSS. This is before I was privy to RDSS2 and computed New Pace partial by hand and partially where I entered them into a spreadsheet where I set up formulas to compute The totals and percent. I won some of the exactas but New Pace had them. Sorry but it is not lined up but you get the picture.

Date Track Race E1/E2 L1/L2 WIN PAID EXACTA $1 PAID
________________________________________________________

7/25 MNR 8 8/2 6/7 8 8.60 8/7 26.50
7/25 MTH 6 1A/7 2/6 7 11.00 7/6 17.10
7/24 MNR 3 2/6 1A/3 1A 10.40 1A/2 20.10
7/23 ELP 3 4/2 5/6 2 7.80
7/17 MTH 5 4/6 5/8 6 13.40
7/10 MNR 7 4/10 7/9 10 14.40

Ernie

Hi Ernie....

By no means I am attacking you, your a good guy and respected by me..
Your showing me 6 hits on 5 different days....
New Pace can give you plays with almost each race on every days card...
so these are your only plays on those days?
did you pass all the others?

mike

[cdax]

I don't have any problem paying the measly $27 for Dave's update. The first week of use of NewPace it easily paid for itself two to three times over.

I would like to post my proof but my major flaw is I do not keep sufficient records. I can probably search through ADW record of my activity to find the hits, oddly enough the big payoffs came from Will Rogers Downs (a track I never played before) and Tampa Bay.

Chris

[mikesal57]

Originally Posted by Dave Schwartz

Ernie,

I must disagree.

Purchase of a product does not entitle you to all future developments for that product. If that were the case, what would be the incentive to continue development?

Just so you know, I (and my team) have roughly 100 hours in the improvements that are being shared, as well as another 9 hours in the development of this particular workshop.

My customers and clients are usually thrilled to pay the small amounts of money charged to ensure that they are on the cutting edge. I hope you can see your way clear to view it from that standpoint. BTW, there IS an Improve/Decline workshop coming as soon as I can quantify the advancements into an updated strategy. (That is still several months away, I believe.)


The almost unanimous feedback I have received from people regarding NewPace, as well as the other products I produce, is that the products are being thoroughly used and enjoyed. The feedback also indicates that these products are considered "good value" for the dollars spent.

People in our industry - that would be the horse handicapping world - are clamoring for good materials. In order for such products to continue being produced, there must be a reasonable financial reward for producing such materials. "Free" will simply not work as a business model.

That said, consider just how much really good information we do put out for free. Next Wednesday will be episode 3 of our Handicapping Live TV cyber show. This show is about The Monty Hall Problem. On that show I will offer up a way to concentrate 2/3 of your winners into 1/3 of your contenders. Free. Did I mention it is completely FREE?

I am trying to raise the bar to a high level and keep it high. We are not some "system mill" cranking out products that come with "get rich quick" claims. We are providing serious, deep research behind the products that go out.

The bottom line for all this is that we live in financial times that are difficult for many (most?) of us. We are trying to offer good value at the lowest possible cost while still justifying being in this industry and producing these materials.

I hope you can see that money spent with us supports that on-going effort and results in everyone getting more and better materials to improve their game.


Regards,
Dave Schwartz

Dave..

We over here at Pace and Cap are a different breed of people.
We are a close knit community that has shared good and bad times with each other. We've met several times around the country and had some good times and continue to each year. We bend over backwards to help each other out and at not one time has their hand open for services rendered.
If you and your team wants to develop products and improvements then by all means go ahead. But remember your doing your advertising on "Free" community boards. Oh yes , I forgot were getting discounts.
Its not the 27 bucks that bothers me, its not much to us OR ever you.
You've taken one concept from the book Percentages and Probabilities and used it to its extreme . Within less than a year you developed Improve/Decline and New Pace and now NP Improvements without a hint of results or feedback from others( I dont consider a one time $100 winner from a poster at PA valid ) . Your a programmer and have a vast database and has a team...how difficult would it have been to produce a program and provide results for everyone to see instead of just throwing it out there?
How much work was done on this when after 3-4 months theres a need for improvements?
On the other hand, Ted has incorporated New Pace into RDSS and has thrown it out to us and didn't ask for a red cent..thats class!!

P.S.- good to hear that Improve/Decline is coming back around again...

mike

[SilentRun]

Originally Posted by mikesal57

Hi Ernie....

By no means I am attacking you, your a good guy and respected by me..
Your showing me 6 hits on 5 different days....
New Pace can give you plays with almost each race on every days card...
so these are your only plays on those days?
did you pass all the others?

mike

No I played other races on those days, I passed some, I Lost some and won some I didn't post. The total number of races I played on those days was about 20+. What I posted was an extract sample in response to your "show me something positive" request.
I am referring to those races that I took the trouble to manually compute the New Pace contenders using a formula based spreadsheet that helped to shorten the time. It was still a pain. Now it is so smooth with RDSS2. Over a period a month I did about 60 races. And....I would not rely on New Pace alone but would only bet if I ran my paceline contenders through RDSS. I find that New Pace is helping me and I am fine with it.

I'll try to provide any info that you request if I could. In fact................
I can copy my original spreadsheet output for all 60 races and mail it to you if you want to...Whatever.

Best Regards,

Ernie

[mikesal57]

Ernie..

what I'm trying to get and I'm sure others will look for is....

What is the bottom line with New Pace?

Is the claim "innovation of the century" applicable?

or is it just another tool

mike

I need a way to quit my day job.....

[Dave Schwartz]

You've taken one concept from the book Percentages and Probabilities and used it to its extreme

Mike,

I do not understand your reference above. What did I take from Percentages and Probabilities? I have certainly learned from P&P, but I am not sure what you mean by your reference.

Is the claim "innovation of the century" applicable? or is it just another tool

Everything is "just a tool." NewPace is a tool, as is Improve/Decline, as is RDSS.

The question, "How good is the tool?" is a valid one. If I post MY results, I must add "your results may differ" then you'll want to know why they will differ. When I say they were done with MY software, will that make you happy? I think not.

You have a guy - GL - who is already posting the heck out of results using HIS version of the TOOL accomplished with the software TOOL that you use. Yet, apparently, these results are not enough for you.

I have been in this business a long time. It is not a coincidence. We're running a business and business, by its nature, runs on money. Money is generated by selling stuff. Longevity is achieved from selling stuff repeatedly to the same customers.

We must be accomplishing this reasonably well or this would not be year 22 for us.

We produce really good stuff that is available at reasonable cost. We try to treat the customer right. Apparently, we aren't for everyone. Apparently, our stuff isn't for you.

Good fortune at the races.


Regards,
Dave Schwartz

[SilentRun]

Originally Posted by mikesal57

Ernie..

what I'm trying to get and I'm sure others will look for is....

What is the bottom line with New Pace?

Is the claim "innovation of the century" applicable?

or is it just another tool

mike

I need a way to quit my day job.....

I gotcha...The best advice I can give you is.."DON'T QUIT YOUR DAY JOB".

Unfortunately I don't know what the bottom line is with NEW PACE. It is too new and there is not enough data to support its authenticity. In any case I am not privy to such data. It is certainly not the "innovation of the century"

From my perspective it is another tool that is showing positive initial results.
This is supported by:

Studies on exacta plays (gl's post)
Running New Pace by Pace & Cap members and posting results.
User feedback.

This is still an evolving product as per Dave Schwartz. IMO it is a very innovative idea.

Like any other product, depending on your understanding and on how you use it, One person can profit and another could get burned. Yet all parties have access to the same information.

That is as far as I can go on this one...only time will tell.

Regards,

Ernie

[gl45]

My 2 cents.
If you want to know if a new handicapping method will be profitable, you must work at it. How many races do you need until it prove itself I don't know. My little project was intended as a black box, with no handicapping necessary.
So far has produced small profits, five more months to the end of the racing meet.
The new screen shot is sample of the collected data from 3/1/2010 to 7/31/2011 for MNR.

cheers

[Ted Craven]

Originally Posted by BJennet

Dave,

I have a four-year old nephew who likes to put on a small cape and run around the house announcing that he's a super-hero, although, fortunately he hasn't destroyed any skyscrapers lately. Your tiresomely hyperbolic claims for a product whose value is absolutely unproven brought him to mind.

I have a suggestion: buy a clue and drop the endless sales drivel about the profound handicapping discoveries of you and your rocket scientist colleagues and start posting large data samples of the ROI performance of New Pace, if you expect to persuade anyone of its value. A 3k sample would be a good start. Better yet, send the algorithm to Jeff Platt, the gold standard for quality and integrity in the field of software handicapping, and let him run it through his 300k race database, since this is an option he offers for free.

You probably think I'm being unnecessarily harsh, but think about it; you're offering an unproven product, which is nothing more than a simple algorithm, which is extremely user-unfriendly, without free trial period for $77, and of course now additional charges. The landmark works of handicapping by Beyer, Brohamer, Davidowitz, Quirin, et. al., which contain enormous amounts of valuable handicapping information, are available for about $25. Cool scam.

Cheers,

B Jennet

BJ,

I'll presume (feel free to correct me though) that you also believe I have either been duped or am in collusion with Dave to either shill his product which may be harmful to one's bottom line, or else willfully distract Sartin Methodology practitioners from their tried and true tools. After having worked so hard for years to build up what I have done so far, and having gained Doc Sartin's respect, I can't imagine why I would want to do either of the foregoing. So I'm confused there. Make no mistake - Dave did not just parachute into PaceandCap shamelessly self-promoting NewPace - I invited him, I asked to include NewPace as another tool among many in the modern Methodology. And like all tools, users must make it their own, bet according to the feedback from their records, meld it with their other approaches. That's the process I see happening here.

In very short order, you will see larger and larger scale studies and ROI proofs using RDSS and NewPace. Some folks have not been doing nothing with this for the past several months. But I expect everyone's mileage to differ: RDSS' BLBL or VDC screen also gives you 4 or 5 contenders, and some folks have this process automated (either in a canned, private software routine) or mechanically by hand. But there is a very wide variance in how one exploits that intelligence in wager decisions. So a 3000 race study of BL/VDC output would show different ROI results for different folks - and different wagers won and lost.

And the same with NewPace. It's up to Dave to answer for his choice to not supply the large scale studies you require. I got no time to waste on that debate - I'm too busy programming the damn thing, co-ordinating users' research presentations (i.e. spreadsheets of whole season runs using Newpace) and helping folks figure out how to use the rest of RDSS. We're moving on, we're doing it. If the whole thing turns out to be a sham, a hoax, I'll tell the world and take responsibility for having wasted people's time. You may participate or snipe from the sidelines, but at any cost you should not give up what is currently working well for you.

Meanwhile, may I recommend just a tetch less antagonism in your next post. You may critique and disagree with anyone, but you know the decorum required here.

Cheers, and stay tuned ...

Ted

[SilentRun]

Originally Posted by SilentRun

Sorry they were typos.............The correct races are:

MTH (not MNR) race 8 from 7/25/11

and

MNR race 10 (not race 7) from 7/10/11.

I'll post the summary results later.

Ernie

Here are the summary results for those races.

Ernie