Setting Dates in Race Conditions

[Segwin]

The attached picture shows the Oct. 28th date - how (and why) do they come up with the dates?

[Bill V.]

Hi Terry

Its hard to answer your question based on what you show in your screen shot.

I need to see the classification of the race.

The date listed in the conditions is important to the race date of the race you are working.

Here is an example ..

At Parx, they have a race class for non winners a 2 races in 6 months

Here are the conditions of such a race from June 11th 2013

I have highlighted 4 things

1. The race date
2. The race classification
3. The race date named in the condition and restrictions relative to the date
of today's race


The race was run on June 11th the classification is a $7500 Claimer non winners of two races in 6 months. The date worded into the conditions
is Dec 11 2012 or 6 mounts prior to the race on June 11th 2013.





In your example the date worded in your screen shot is October 28 2012
so since I do not know the date of the race from which these conditions come from, I don't know the time restrictions of when a horse could have won

To answer your question,
Look at the race date of the conditions you in post 1
Now see how far back October 28th is from the date of the race

Let us know

-

By the way here Is the winner of the June 11th race.
Sophia has 1of her 2 allowed win in line 4. She won against $7500 non winners of 1 race in 6 months. After that win they raced her up a few steps.
In line 1 she dueled hard and was involved in the early pace of race
before fading, I would give this line a (+)

Now on June 11th She ran in a $7500 non winner of 2 in 6 months.
So the early speed and the drop in class was enough that she won.
She only paid $5.00 but she fit the conditions and guidelines.







Bill



-

[Appy]

Bill, in your line section process, do you have an order of preference you follow?

IOW, if you have a + line that is within your recency guideline, but one of A)distance or B)race class level is not a match to today's race, which do you override first in order to select that line?

[Segwin]

The race was from yesterday at IND DWNS. I did a search here as well and found a good post by FTL on the subject. I don't have the link handy though - am playing PRX but think I'll pull the plug. No sense hitting your head against the wall.

[Because I Can Jim]

Terry,

Correct me if I am wrong, but, I am interpreting your question as:

How does the "Racing Secretary" come up with the date in the conditions and why?

In answer to that question, in my studying of class, everyone seems to know about "The Handicapper's Condition Book" by James Quinn which is an advanced treatment of thoroughbred class. And that it is - an "advanced" treatment.

I also came across the following:

"Class" in thoroughbred racing: And how to find it
by Chuck Badone (1987)

A short book and although it is dated 1987, it was very useful - well worth the $8 I spent on it.

In it, he talks about how the racing secretary goes about writing the conditions for the races so that different classes of horses have a chance to be able to win a race. (Of course I am paraphrasing here since I've only read it once and still have not assimilated all of the information.) Part of this is done using a date. It helps narrow down the number of horses that are of that class level to have an opportunity to win a race.

For example, if you think about a Claiming 5000 horse, (I am thinking about Mountaineer that has a plethora of C5000 races as I write this), that horse could have won 1, 2, 3, 5, 10 races over its lifetime (NW1, NW2, NW3, NW4 lifetime, etc..). There are probably quite a few horses that fit this bill that run at MNR. Then there are horses that may have just won their Maiden Claiming at say 10,000. Obviously, a winner against open company is of a higher class than the maiden which has not faced open competition and is still unproven.

By writing the conditions to say NW2-6M (non-winners of 2 races in 6 months) other than maiden claiming or starter, the conditions not only exclude higher priced allowance horses, but also excludes/includes horses based upon a time limitation as opposed to say NW2-1Y (non-winners of 2 races in one year).

What the racing secretary is basically trying to do is to give horses who have not won, an opportunity to win. Remember, a good percentage of the horses are housed at the track or within driving distance. The trainers needs to make money on these horses, otherwise, why run them other than the obvious reason of paying for themselves if the horse just cannot compete in the race due to the competition it is facing? Why introduce the risk?

The racing secretary needs to have horses in a race so that the public will bet on them for the track to be able to get its take. If the secretary writes races without conditions, as a trainer, I am not going to risk my horse in a race that I know it cannot win against particular horses. By having the conditions such as a time limitation, that excludes better horses that have won two races in the last six months which might easily beat my horse. It gives the trainer an opportunity to enter the horse and win a purse.

I hope I am doing justice to the idea. Any of the more knowledgeable on this aspect of class, feel free to chime in.

Jim

[Bill V.]

Hi Terry

Thanks for the additional info, First thing I could think was
the conditions say non winners of 4 life OR non winners if 3 in
the time frame of 50 weeks.
Since the Oct 28 date in the conditions is two weeks shy of one year from today's race. or 351 days, or 50 weeks, I looked at the horses with more than 3 wins in the race
Those were horses 1A 4 and 5. They get in to the race
because they have not won 3 races in the time frame written in the conditions

I looked to see if any horse had won near the Oct 28 2012 cut off point to see
if the race was written to allow this horse in. I did not see such a horse

Besides the 50 week time frame I am not sure why they used that date

[Segwin]

Thanks for the replies guys. So much to process.

I thought that when they do this perhaps there is an opportunity to see if a horse that the conditions are written for or is favored or not.

BTW Jim I just got my copy of "The Handicapper's Condition Book" by James Quinn in the mail today.

[For The Lead]

Originally Posted by Because I Can Jim

Terry,


By writing the conditions to say NW2-6M (non-winners of 2 races in 6 months) other than maiden claiming or starter, the conditions not only exclude higher priced allowance horses, but also excludes/includes horses based upon a time limitation as opposed to say NW2-1Y (non-winners of 2 races in one year).

Jim

Just one comment.

I am not aware of any condition for NW26M with an "other than" sipulation.
"Other than" are words that are found in either Allowance races or Allowance Optional Claiming races.

However, there is an operative phrase connected with these types of conditions that indicate races won a some lower claiming price are excluded. This is indicated in the condition abbreviation by an "X" and the end. i.e.- NW26MX As an example...



As you can see, this is a $7,500 claiming race, but races won where the horse was entered for $5,000 or less do not count. A horse may have won 5 races at $5,000 or less and still be eligible for this race.

[Bill V.]

Originally Posted by For The Lead

Just one comment.

I am not aware of any condition for NW26M with an "other than" sipulation.
"Other than" are words that are found in either Allowance races or Allowance Optional Claiming races.

However, there is an operative phrase connected with these types of conditions that indicate races won a some lower claiming price are excluded. This is indicated in the condition abbreviation by an "X" and the end. i.e.- NW26MX As an example...

Attachment 35978



As you can see, this is a $7,500 claiming race, but races won where the horse was entered for $5,000 or less do not count. A horse may have won 5 races at $5,000 or less and still be eligible for this race.

FTL and Jim

At Parx they do allow horses from lower level claimers into the higher level claiming races for non winners of 2 races in 6 months.

Here is a race from July 8th 2013.The conditions are CL 12.5 N2-6M
which is January 8th 2013




Here is a horse in the race named Prince of Dreams.
As I show and talk about in this video Prince has 4 wins since
January 8th. It is in this race because the wins were from the 7500 claiming level. and 1 time from the 12.5 claiming level but for non winners of 1 race in 6 months. The conditions allow multiple winners as long as they won in $7500
or less claiming races .

my video comments

nonwinner_2.mp4

[Segwin]

Thanks for the video Bill.