The 'Red-board' Discussion!

[atlasaxis]

Very good Hoof, that's exactly the point of a post race analysis, you went back AFTER you did a pre race analysis, to see where you went wrong in the event that you didn't win. How in the world would you know where you went wrong WITHOUT a prerace analysis? You wouldn't! If you won, what did you learn? Very little! Why? Because you got paid for that which you already knew! Each failure (lost race) offers a handicapping lesson. Winners do a post mortem after losing a race to find out why they lost. Post race analysis WITHOUT a prerace analysis IS simply redboarding/backfitting/cherry picking and has VERY limited value. It is VERY misleading and dishonest to the new person looking to find his/her way. Why? Because it's only PART of the truth and part of the truth not seen in the context of the whole, is a lie (see - you too could have had this $50 winner if you just did this and this and this and this..).

As I said before, any one of you with even just a limited understand of your methodology (ALL of which is found in your Follow Ups) could take ANY race after it's been run and give reason for choosing contenders and pretenders, why a horse won or loss. That doesn't make you money. What does is being able to correctly do it BEFORE the race is run.

I am not negating the importance of a post race analysis, I'm just putting it in its proper place, AFTER a prerace analysis and BEFORE the race is run.

You all can flame away all you want, Apparently I've struck a nerve with some of you on both sides of the fence. That's good, people need to think for themselves and not just blindly follow a part truth.

This will be my last post on this topic, hold the applause please!` If you all are happy and making money, then that's all that matters, just keep on keeping on.

Peace.

[Hoof 11]

You make some very good points and i understand what you're are trying to say, it's the way you went about it that bothers me. There aren't a lot of people willing to share their knowledge, and when someone flames the one's that do post, it usually stops them from posting, and that's not what this site is about. We are all here to become better at this game, not to get sh*t on.

If you would have posted what you stated above in the first place, people would not have gotten all bent out of shape. Calling FTL a joke and all that other stuff was uncalled for, and really doesn't help anybody in the end. FTL is simply sharing some good knowledge of the game and the methodology, and he is not trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes.

I think a valuable lesson was learned here, and Atlas makes some good points, for future reference it might be a good idea to post (pre) and (post) analysis of a race. Whether someone is betting the race or not, is irrelevant, it's the learning process that is important in the end.

By the way..... how are you making out in the PAIHL contest?

[atlasaxis]

You mean the one kicking my @$$ right now? lol Don't know if this saying has made it to the north of the border yet but ya win some, ya lose some and some get rained out!

[Mark]

I'm almost 63, won my first bet at 15 at Del Mar, a $180 Daily Double that my grandmother had to place for me. Like many handicappers I have struggled over the years to make a consistent profit whether I used my own method or anyone of 10 different software programs. However, I learned from every handicapping book or software program and group I used or was involved with. Alot of that changed in the early 90's when I started attending Sartin Seminars. "The Doc", "The Hat", Tom Brohammer, Dick Schmidt, Tom Hambleton and many others each had some impact on me. The fact that the Pace and Cap website has chosen to carry forward the traditions of these authors and handicappers and that it has developed a following is a testiment to their legacy. It is not so much the content as it is the forum for those who feel they have something to contribute that I feel is important. The teaching threads are outstanding and the Hat Check has allowed me to understand and utilize "The Match Up" as I always wanted to but never could.
For those who would object to the free offering of someone's elses thoughts or findings to others is something I find hard to understand. No one is forced to read these threads or to undertake to register to contribute comments on this site. I find it selfserving and intellectually corrupt.
I offer my appreciation and congratulations to those that continue to post meaningful information in light of these attacks. And while all should have their say, I feel there is no place for repeated derogatory comments and personal attacks. Those that have pychological issues that foster this behavior achieve their control and attention getting goals. The forum management should not enable this behavior as it is destructive and counter productive to building trust and sharing of ideas, in my opinion

[Bill V.]

Well said Mark

Welcome to Pace and Cap

Bill

[DaveEdwards]

That I particularly appreciate the time FTL and others take to share their knowledge in order to help.

For me looking at an event after the fact is perfectly fine in order to demonstrate a concept. The issue isn't one of backfitting, more one of pattern recognition for future use. Well for me at least anyway, although I'm happy to concede that different people do have varying learning styles.