Synergism 4 Data Entry

[Houndog]

I did a little experiment. I made up a race at Charlestown at 7 furlongs. I used 5th's like what would be in the racing form or converting to tenths. As you can see converting the times your input affects the EPR greatly. I made up 4 pacelines. The difference becomes greater if you convert a first fraction of 23.4 to 23.8.

As you can see by leaving the fraction at 23.4 and not converting to tenths the projected 1st fraction is correct. Converting to tenths throws it way off. I think my logic is correct here.

My advice is NOT to convert the running times from fifths as you see in the racing form, or any other source you use. Enter the running times Exactly as shown in the Racing Form. The attached screenshot illustrates what I am talking about. As you can see in makes a big difference in EPR in this case.

Jeff, raised the point and as it turns out it makes a big difference in some of the readouts.

[Dumptruk]

When I was updating the pars I was wondering the same thing. The par editor asked for times in 10ths.

I was curious if VALM input is supposed to be in 5ths or 10ths.

[partsnut]

In my opinion the program calls for 10ths.
You will notice that when you input a "Route" the second call input is spurious when using fifths.
I suggest that a number like a 110.80 for the should be put in as 70.8 for the second call. It seems the program is formatted in this manner.

I might be wrong but it seems to work for me.

[Houndog]

Originally Posted by Dumptruk

When I was updating the pars I was wondering the same thing. The par editor asked for times in 10ths.

I was curious if VALM input is supposed to be in 5ths or 10ths.

In Synergism IV I did update the pars in 10th's using the HSH pars which are actually in hundreths. For instance if a par at a certain track was 112.86 at 6 furlongs I rounded up to the nearest tenth which was 112.9 If it was 112.85 or below I rounded it to 112.8.

I have been entering data as shown in the Daily Racing Form without converting to tenths. I will test this with route races and get back with you.

[Houndog]

Originally Posted by partsnut

In my opinion the program calls for 10ths.
You will notice that when you input a "Route" the second call input is spurious when using fifths.
I suggest that a number like a 110.80 for the should be put in as 70.8 for the second call. It seems the program is formatted in this manner.

I might be wrong but it seems to work for me.

Parts, I just want to make sure that we are on the same page. If we are talking about the pars that came with program I did not use the par editor that came with the program, but a NOTEPAD replacement (VEDIT). If I used the par editor that came with the program updating the pars would have taken forever and I would still be working on them.

The original par file did not have the time in seconds, but minutes and seconds when required. I did use tenths but did not need to change for example 110.80 to 70.8.

If we are talking about the data input I will give you an example in a route race at AP (Arlington Park) 1 mile distance.


The first 2 lines assume running lines as shown in the form as 46.3-112.3-137.3. The first line is entered as shown in the Racing Form. The Second line is when I converted the running lines to tenths. So it is now 46.6-112.6-137.6 using the same beaten lengths and variant.

Same thing for the 3rd and 4th line. The change is greater now with running lines as you would see in the form of 46.4-112.4-137.4. Converting to tenths would be 46.8-112.8-137.8.

I notice when I enter 112.3 (or whatever) it converts it 112.33.

The last line represents a running line of 47.0-113.0-138.0 again with beaten lengths of 1 1 1 and a variant of 17. The TPR is higher than line 4 and tied with line 2. This suggests to me no conversion is necessary and in some cases converting from 5th's to 10h's makes slower horses faster.

Parts, I do respect your opinion and if doing it your way works for you by all means don't change. It seems to me that Bob Purdy would not have required a person to make the adjustment from 5th's to 10th's since that has not been a requirement of the other Sartin Manual Entry programs that he and others helped develop.

[partsnut]

Houndog:

Parts, I just want to make sure that we are on the same page. If we are talking about the pars that came with program I did not use the par editor that came with the program, but a NOTEPAD replacement (VEDIT). If I used the par editor that came with the program updating the pars would have taken forever and I would still be working on them.

Mike, the par times are fine the way you have them.

I'm talking about the actual data entry into the program.

Last night I tried to enter the second call in a route 112.80
and it came up 112.88
If I would have entered 72.8 it might have worked correctly.
I believe the second call is formatted in this way, just as the first call is, and may have a problem the other way. Correct me if I'm wrong.
I also think the program is formatted for 10ths as opposed to 5ths.

Despite my doubts the program gave me 2 seconds and a $21.00 +
winner in the 7th race. This was out of 4 races.
Just think what it will do using the correct format.
Yesterday was my first try with it. I hate to type.

With Syn 2 I use Speedplus to convert the lines and this issue does not come into play. There is no typing. My converted lines are adjusted for pars and variants and then put into Syn 2
Everything else is automatic.
SYN 2 will take a 9.5 furlong race - Syn 4 won't
I will say that Syn 4 has more read-outs to look at and is slightly more impressive to look at.

[shoeless]

Mike,I agree with you and the TPR numbers are working great.Thanks Jeff

[Houndog]

Originally Posted by partsnut

Houndog:





Mike, the par times are fine the way you have them.

I'm talking about the actual data entry into the program.

Last night I tried to enter the second call in a route 112.80
and it came up 112.88
If I would have entered 72.8 it might have worked correctly.
I believe the second call is formatted in this way, just as the first call is, and may have a problem the other way. Correct me if I'm wrong.
I also think the program is formatted for 10ths as opposed to 5ths.

Despite my doubts the program gave me 2 seconds and a $21.00 +
winner in the 7th race. This was out of 4 races.
Just think what it will do using the correct format.
Yesterday was my first try with it. I hate to type.

With Syn 2 I use Speedplus to convert the lines and this issue does not come into play. There is no typing. My converted lines are adjusted for pars and variants and then put into Syn 2
Everything else is automatic.
SYN 2 will take a 9.5 furlong race - Syn 4 won't
I will say that Syn 4 has more read-outs to look at and is slightly more impressive to look at.

Part's it's all good. The only thing that matters is the results at the mutual window. I e-mailed Bob Purdy asking the same question. Here for the most part is his reply. I see it does put 112.88 instead of 112.80. If I enter 72.8 it will look like 72..8. I take all of your observations seriously, and your input is always welcome since you are one of the innovative thinkers on this board.
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Hi Mike,

If memory serves me right (it's been a long time since I wrote version IV), the 3 Year Best times are used to make the Track to Track adjustments.

I also seem to remember that the times were entered in 5ths because at that time, the DRF did not publish the times in 10ths.

Continued good success with the program.

Kindest regards,

Bob Purdy